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  • Go forth and....well, pirating things is wrong, so...

    Rules to remember:

    1. No talk about the promo or spoilers. Those go on the spoiler thread, labelled 7x03, etc.

    2. Constructive criticism and critiques are allowed, but negative thoughts, especially those at length, are best in the Rant and Rave board.

    3. Feel free to discuss the episode at length, ask questions to clarify things, and have hope! (Maybe not that last one...XD)

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    • Can we edit the pages accordingly now?

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    • Ok. Emma is totally going to return at sone point. They left the door totally open I mean, Henry has to meet his brother/sister

      This is getting better

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    • 8Rob wrote:
      Ok. Emma is totally going to return at sone point.

      They left the door totally open I mean, Henry has to meet his brother/sister

      This is getting better

      Maybe not - it's been over 2 decades (at minimum) for Henry, and only about 3 years for Emma as of that flashback. It's possible that Emma hasn't given birth yet...

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    • great episode. Emma is going to have a baby and Rogers is Hook form the wish realm. the real Hook is in Storybrooke with Emma. cool. i get it now. 

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    • Wow, I did not see that twist coming with the two Hooks! Can someone clarify what Wish Realm Hook was saying while he was dying? I heard him in the beginning about his daughter being imprisoned and how he visited her every day to play chess with her, but I didn't hear him clearly for the part he talked about having his heart poisoned or something so he could never find her?

      Edit: Nevermind. :) Got my answer from reading the episode addition to Hook (Wish Realm)'s page. Thanks DatNuttyKid!

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    • Fairly certain that Hook (Wish Realm)'s daughter is Rapunzel. He talked about her being locked in a tower. 

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    • Interesting episode. Rogers is actually the cursed form of a de-aged Wish Realm Hook, who appearently had a daughter that is more or less confirmed to be NEF Rapunzel. Great, just what we all wanted. XD

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    • I think Wish Hook's daughter is Jacinda, as he clearly has some history with Tremaine.

      And whoever his daughter is, who's the mother? Maybe Wish Realm Milah???

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    • Or maybe his daughter is Alice

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    • Just sad that this episode was the last we saw of Emma and Hook. :'( Also sad that we won't get to see Emma and Hook with their baby. :'( But was surprised to see Wish Realm Hook in this episode. That was a very big twist for me. And now I'm wondering who's the daughter and the mother of the daughter is. Those will keep me wondering until it's answered. 

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    • Just wanted to share something that blew my mind when I realized it tonight. I'm sure people realized this the second that Henry's wife was revealed to be Cinderella, but...

      Henry is the grandson of Prince Charming. So he's a Charming. And he's also a prince. Which makes Henry a Prince Charming himself.

      I remember when this show first came out, people were confused when Thomas was introduced because in the Disney movie, HE was Prince Charming, while Snow's prince was just Prince Florian.

      But here's the thing. Cinderella's prince charming? His name in the Disney movie... Is Henri.

      OUR Henry, Henry Mills, is the Prince "Charming" Henri that ends up with Cinderella. Which makes sense, since this Cinderella has Drizella and Anastasia as stepsisters, making her much more similar to the Disney counterpart than Ashley.

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    • I'm not sure they made a great move here in efforts to preserve some viewers. For the rest of the season we get a Hook looking for a child....but it's not the actual Hook with a CS child, it's his child with another random new woman. So essentially an entirely new character with a whole different backstory, which begs me to question: how much do they expect his fans to care going forward?Strange storytelling decision.

      There was more Weaver than I was expecting, so I guess that's nice. Another episode in and I'm still down for adult Henry. The rest of the newbies are still TBD.

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    • HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:
      Ok. Emma is totally going to return at sone point.

      They left the door totally open I mean, Henry has to meet his brother/sister

      This is getting better

      Maybe not - it's been over 2 decades (at minimum) for Henry, and only about 3 years for Emma as of that flashback. It's possible that Emma hasn't given birth yet...

      How has Emma not given birth yet? This is when Henry is meeting Cinderella, and Lucy's already 10 in the present day. Her and Hook easily have an 11 year old kid running around Storybrooke right now. (OMG I'm so old...)

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    • Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:
      Ok. Emma is totally going to return at sone point.

      They left the door totally open I mean, Henry has to meet his brother/sister

      This is getting better

      Maybe not - it's been over 2 decades (at minimum) for Henry, and only about 3 years for Emma as of that flashback. It's possible that Emma hasn't given birth yet...
      How has Emma not given birth yet? This is when Henry is meeting Cinderella, and Lucy's already 10 in the present day. Her and Hook easily have an 11 year old kid running around Storybrooke right now. (OMG I'm so old...)

      Time runs differently in the NEF.

      I'll give my thoughts later. Gotta figure out what they are first xD

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    • This episode and it's twist were interesting to say the least. To know that Hook this season is not the Hook we've seen since season 2 is something I didn't expect. But how can Wish Realm Hook have a past with Lady Tamarine of Fairytale land 2?

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    • Eskaver
      Eskaver removed this reply because:
      No spoilers
      11:22, October 14, 2017
      This reply has been removed
    • Avatar Beta wrote:
      This episode and it's twist were interesting to say the least. To know that Hook this season is not the Hook we've seen since season 2 is something I didn't expect. But how can Wish Realm Hook have a past with Lady Tamarine of Fairytale land 2?

      It was implied during their interaction that she might've been the Lady Tremaine of the Wish Realm (which would make no sense, since Wish Realm inhabitants were alternate lives of the original Book's inhabitants, meaning we would've had to see a much older --through make-up-- Lisa Bane, not Gabrielle Anwar).

      She may have met him in another realm, however. Since he seemed to be traveling from world to world. Also, can we talk about the very weird fact that multiple books can interact? The Wish Realm, which is an alternate version of the "real Book" has its inhabitants traveling to both the "real Book" and the "new Book".

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    • If this Lady Tremaine is from the WishWorld that doesnt mean she was Ladt Tremaine there. She only took that role when she got older. When she was young, she was the WishWorld version of anorher character from our old Enchanted Forest

      Example:

      A woman called.... let's say Ana.

      Ana is played by a young actress in the Enchanted Forest. Then Ana is played by an older actress in the WishWorld, in this case Gabrielle Anwar. (Because all of them are older in the WishWorld) Then she traveled to the NEF, got married with Cinderella's father, etc.

      The question is, was she anorher known character when she was younger or just a random peasant?

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    • Im not sure about WHook's daugther

      From the sequence of scenes, I'd think the daughter is Jacinda, because there was a short Jacinda scene inserted between 2 WHook's scenes talking about his daugther

      From the chess piece he had, the Rook, I'd say the daugther is Rapunzel, because well the rook piece is a tower.

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    • I was not expecting that twist. One of the reasons I love OUaT, keeps me on my toes. I think this was actually a very clever way to move Hook's character along. At this point I think Repunzel will be the daughter mainly based on the tower and evil witch. I'm really loving Weaver, I think he's the best out of the returning 3. He is still my Rumple under there I just know it. He didn't let mommy curse him, and I don't know but something is telling me that he may not be under this time either. Maybe I'm just projecting my own hopes. I'm ready to see some more about Roni. I'm happy with the way they handled the JMo, CS stuff. Overall I think it was a pretty good episode.

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    • Now that's a twist that hadn't even crossed my mind. I missed those in OUAT. 

      I got goosebumps when Emma showed up in the New Enchanted Forest. I admit the show is different without her but I'm fine with the small dose of Swan we got. 

      Regina staying to be with Henry was good, Emma holding Hook's hook was possibly the cutest thing I've seen from them, I still love Sabine and Jacinda's friendship and Rumple's just... not interesting so far. 

      I finally swallowed that we're getting characters from an alternative universe and now I'm okay as long as they mention Jessy Schram's Cinderella at some point. You know, acknowledge she exists too. 

      Now as I've said on the other thread, I really don't mind Hyperion's Hook being Wish Realm Hook but why give him such a big and heavy storyline? And with her daughter possibly being Rapunzel, it will only make things more complicated for the viewers. 

      Anyway, they did what they thought best given their situation. CaptainSwan is happy in Storybrooke, Colin is still in our screens, we got brand new stories to explore, I'm ok. 

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    • I didn't expect WishHook. I did expect for the second Hook to be the one staying behind and I did see rumors about him searching for a daughter.

      Have to rewatch, but Hook-W did know Tremaine from elsewhere, unless we assume it's during the many trips to NEF. But she knows him for sure. Thinking Tremaine isn't from NEF and has a past with Hook-W.

      A bit more than I expected for this episode. Continues Hook's track record of not being cursed, lol.

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    • Eskaver wrote:
      I didn't expect WishHook. I did expect for the second Hook to be the one staying behind and I did see rumors about him searching for a daughter.

      Have to rewatch, but Hook-W did know Tremaine from elsewhere, unless we asusme it's during the many trips to NEF. But she knows him for sure.

      A bit more than I expected for this episode. Continues Hook's track record of not being cursed, lol.

      Yep, Hook and Emma are never really cursed. Guess that's why they are true love. XD

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    • Saving my grade after a rewatch, but geez, fan outlook is self-torture.

      Fan: "Why a new realm? Why new characters? Hook angst again? So dumb!"

      A&E: Here's Wish Hook!

      Fan: "What? That should have stayed dead in season 6! Why not Real Hook?"

      Then there's...

      Season 6 Fan: Why is everything so predictable?

      Season 7 Fan: Why is everything so confusing?

      Fan: Why are they copying season 1?

      Fan: Tremaine sucks! Why isn't she like season 1 Regina?

      Who knew fandom could be so wondrous? XD

      The episode was decent and set up new plots, but kept the story doing something. I do agree that flashbacks seem to be a little more intriguing than present day.

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    • Interesting episode. It gives acreative way of havig Hook on the show without Emma. I feel like if Emma is pregnant, we definitely need to see the baby at some point. Why is Hook starting to get his memmory back? Does Rumpel know something that everyone else doesn't know?

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    • I loved this episode. There are some things I would have liked more of, but I’m not complaining because the ending they gave CS was the best I could have expected. I would have loved to have a scene with Emma, Killian, and their child, but that’s okay because then we can make our own head cannons about the baby and I kind of love that. There are so many things I want to say about this episode. It was the end of an era, an absolutely wonderful era. Emma Swan’s journey has meant so much to me and to see her find her happiness is everything. I thought I would be sad at the end of this episode since this is Jen’s last, but I wasn’t. I was so, so satisfied, and best of all, happy with the way they handled the situation. I loved that they brought in Old/Wish Hook, it was something that had already been set up and I thought the writers handled the situation beautifully.

      I loved how at the beginning of the episode, Rogers (who is actually Wish Hook magically turned young) showed up at Henry’s apartment asking about Emma and then they revealed that she saved him from dying, but also from himself in a way, just like Emma did with Original Killian. I think the thing I loved most about this episode was that Wish Hook saw the error of his ways in wanting to steal Emma from Killian in order to break his daughter’s curse and instead chose to do the right thing, to be a hero, which plays into the present day situation. This means we’re getting to see Wish Hook redeemed himself, which I love the idea of, since it’s well, you know, Killian. I also loved how Emma wanted Henry to find his story/happy ending since he gave her her happy ending and that she wanted Henry and Wish Hook to team up. I was surprised that Henry changed the name of the operation, I really liked Glass Slipper. 

      I also loved the Hyperion Heights story. I loved how Henry was trying to fix things and how Jacinda didn’t want his help. This episode was also where I first felt the extent of Tremaine/Victoria’s evilness. $550 for tickets?! That is outrageous. Granted, I have no idea how much ballet tickets normally cost, but that’s still a lot. I loved how Rogers showed up at Henry’s apartment asking about Emma and decided to help him find where his family is buried. I am really enjoying Rogers and Weaver’s dynamic. I always enjoyed it during the original show, though. I loved how the writers set up the “good cop, bad cop” dynamic this episode. I also loved how at the very end of the episode we get to see, Henry, Rogers, and Roni decide to take down Tremaine.

      I had some questions at the end of the episode. Namely what did Wish Hook do to Tremaine and who is the mother of his child. The Wish Hook situation did set up a potential love interest situation, but I think the writers will honor Captain Swan and not go through with it. If they do, I’m not sure how I will feel. I think I might be okay with it, but I also might not. Whatever happens, I’m excited. I am going to miss Emma and Captain Swan like crazy, but I’m ready for Operation Next Chapter/Glass Slipper.

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    • My main issue with this episode is if the "magic bottle" was able to go to BOTH Hooks, then why didn't the Evil Queen show up as well from the wish relm?  Even though she doesn't go as Regina she still is technically Regina and is one of Henry's moms.  

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    • DSP88 wrote:
      My main issue with this episode is if the "magic bottle" was able to go to BOTH Hooks, then why didn't the Evil Queen show up as well from the wish relm?  Even though she doesn't go as Regina she still is technically Regina and is one of Henry's moms.  


      Because, Regina does not have a bottle to receive the message? Because the Wish Realm version of Regina is banished somewhere and prolly unable to go free?

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    • Lady Junky wrote:
      DSP88 wrote:
      My main issue with this episode is if the "magic bottle" was able to go to BOTH Hooks, then why didn't the Evil Queen show up as well from the wish relm?  Even though she doesn't go as Regina she still is technically Regina and is one of Henry's moms.  

      Because, Regina does not have a bottle to receive the message? Because the Wish Realm version of Regina is banished somewhere and prolly unable to go free?

      The Evil Queen wasn't banished anywhere.  She was free to move from the Wish Realm to the Enchanted Forest with Robin.  It's my understanding that there is only ONE magic bottle and that was given to Henry by Hook and Henry spoke in it to get Regina, Hook and Emma to come save him.  So it still doesn't explain why the Evil Queen didn't come when the other Hook did.  The only explanation I can see why she didn't come is if she's dead.  I love the show but these plotholes are getting too frequent.  

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    • Lady Junky wrote:
      DSP88 wrote:
      My main issue with this episode is if the "magic bottle" was able to go to BOTH Hooks, then why didn't the Evil Queen show up as well from the wish relm?  Even though she doesn't go as Regina she still is technically Regina and is one of Henry's moms.  

      Because, Regina does not have a bottle to receive the message? Because the Wish Realm version of Regina is banished somewhere and prolly unable to go free?

      And what about the Serum EQ? 

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    • DSP88 wrote:
      Lady Junky wrote:
      DSP88 wrote:
      My main issue with this episode is if the "magic bottle" was able to go to BOTH Hooks, then why didn't the Evil Queen show up as well from the wish relm?  Even though she doesn't go as Regina she still is technically Regina and is one of Henry's moms.  

      Because, Regina does not have a bottle to receive the message? Because the Wish Realm version of Regina is banished somewhere and prolly unable to go free?
      The Evil Queen wasn't banished anywhere.  She was free to move from the Wish Realm to the Enchanted Forest with Robin.  It's my understanding that there is only ONE magic bottle and that was given to Henry by Hook and Henry spoke in it to get Regina, Hook and Emma to come save him.  So it still doesn't explain why the Evil Queen didn't come when the other Hook did.  The only explanation I can see why she didn't come is if she's dead.  I love the show but these plotholes are getting too frequent.  

      You're mixing up everything ^^ You're talking about the Evil Queen (Serum) :) She is NOT the Evil Queen (Wish Realm). Not the same character :)

      The Wish Realm is an alternate reality of the first Enchanted Forest, like another Enchanted Forest with all same elements/characters but living different stories :) (Which is different from the New Enchanted Forest ^^) So, if a bottle exist in the first EF, then a Wish Realm version of this bottle exist too.

      The Evil Queen (Serum) can't have a bottle if Hook is the one who had it. Wish Hook had the Wish Realm version of the bottle :)

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    • There are 3 Reginas

      -Our original Regina

      -The WishWorld Evil Queen, who was only mentioned, she never appeared on screen

      -The Serum Queen aka Queenie, who is now living with Robin in the EF castle

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    • Lady Junky wrote:
      DSP88 wrote:
      Lady Junky wrote:
      DSP88 wrote:
      My main issue with this episode is if the "magic bottle" was able to go to BOTH Hooks, then why didn't the Evil Queen show up as well from the wish relm?  Even though she doesn't go as Regina she still is technically Regina and is one of Henry's moms.  

      Because, Regina does not have a bottle to receive the message? Because the Wish Realm version of Regina is banished somewhere and prolly unable to go free?
      The Evil Queen wasn't banished anywhere.  She was free to move from the Wish Realm to the Enchanted Forest with Robin.  It's my understanding that there is only ONE magic bottle and that was given to Henry by Hook and Henry spoke in it to get Regina, Hook and Emma to come save him.  So it still doesn't explain why the Evil Queen didn't come when the other Hook did.  The only explanation I can see why she didn't come is if she's dead.  I love the show but these plotholes are getting too frequent.  
      You're mixing up everything ^^ You're talking about the Evil Queen (Serum) :) She is NOT the Evil Queen (Wish Realm). Not the same character :)

      The Wish Realm is an alternate reality of the first Enchanted Forest, like another Enchanted Forest with all same elements/characters but living different stories :) (Which is different from the New Enchanted Forest ^^) So, if a bottle exist in the first EF, then a Wish Realm version of this bottle exist too.

      The Evil Queen (Serum) can't have a bottle if Hook is the one who had it. Wish Hook had the Wish Realm version of the bottle :)

      I know, i didn't confused anything, my question was, why the Serum EQ didn't appeared when Henry called out for help. But i got it.

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    • This was a fine episode. I liked the present day scenes and the last few scenes with Emma, but I didn’t like the idea of Wish Realm Hook. In some ways it was better than last week’s episode, such as the pacing, in other ways it was worse.

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    • Wait, these questions bugged me so much during the episode. 

      1. Is the Old Hook we see in 7x02 the Wish Realm Hook from 6x11?

      2. If the Old Hook (7x02) is the Wish Realm Hook from 6x11, how did he get to The New Enchanted Forest?

      (P.S. I know I asked these on a different forum blog, but I really need these answered XD)

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    • I think the episode was decent, ironically all the parts without Emma were better, it's not that the Emma scenes were bad, they were just meaningless, aside from the scene with Wish!Hook, it's just to say goodbye to Jennifer Morrison. But on the other hand, I'm happy that Emma and Hook got to exit the series together!

      So I'm not disappointed, I knew what to expect, I'm glad Emma did 6 scenes despite being on set only for 2 days, and I definitely didn't expect that new billing "special guest starring" for Jennifer, that never happened before on the show, a real surprise and well deserved.

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    • The Great Sorcerer wrote:

      Wait, these questions bugged me so much during the episode. 

      1. Is the Old Hook we see in 7x02 the Wish Realm Hook from 6x11?

      2. If the Old Hook (7x02) is the Wish Realm Hook from 6x11, how did he get to The New Enchanted Forest?

      (P.S. I know I asked these on a different forum blog, but I really need these answered XD)

      1: Yes.

      2: Hats, beans, shadows, doors, twigs, and dust have all shown the power to open portals. I don't think that question matters anymore. (Poor Rumple.)

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    • I'm really happy with the CGI improvements. 

      For example, the characters don't have purple or green reflections on their skin and clothing anymore, when they are on a green or blue screen. Like this one... 

      319FearingTheWorst2.png


      And the CGI sets aren't as gleamy and blurry as before! Just look at this CGI set from before...

      107WalkingToFireplace.png

      And now this green screen set..

      701Ball.png


      All in all, I feel like they're doing a better job with the CGI. Not the best, of course, but better.

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    • LadyTremaine wrote:
      Lady Junky wrote:
      DSP88 wrote:
      Lady Junky wrote:
      DSP88 wrote:
      My main issue with this episode is if the "magic bottle" was able to go to BOTH Hooks, then why didn't the Evil Queen show up as well from the wish relm?  Even though she doesn't go as Regina she still is technically Regina and is one of Henry's moms.  

      Because, Regina does not have a bottle to receive the message? Because the Wish Realm version of Regina is banished somewhere and prolly unable to go free?
      The Evil Queen wasn't banished anywhere.  She was free to move from the Wish Realm to the Enchanted Forest with Robin.  It's my understanding that there is only ONE magic bottle and that was given to Henry by Hook and Henry spoke in it to get Regina, Hook and Emma to come save him.  So it still doesn't explain why the Evil Queen didn't come when the other Hook did.  The only explanation I can see why she didn't come is if she's dead.  I love the show but these plotholes are getting too frequent.  
      You're mixing up everything ^^ You're talking about the Evil Queen (Serum) :) She is NOT the Evil Queen (Wish Realm). Not the same character :)

      The Wish Realm is an alternate reality of the first Enchanted Forest, like another Enchanted Forest with all same elements/characters but living different stories :) (Which is different from the New Enchanted Forest ^^) So, if a bottle exist in the first EF, then a Wish Realm version of this bottle exist too.

      The Evil Queen (Serum) can't have a bottle if Hook is the one who had it. Wish Hook had the Wish Realm version of the bottle :)

      I know, i didn't confused anything, my question was, why the Serum EQ didn't appeared when Henry called out for help. But i got it.

      Evil Queen wouldn't have shown up because she was not called. Henry specifically called Reginia and Hook. Evil Queen is a seperated entity now, not connected to Reginia, so bottle would have no reason to go to her.

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    • Am i the only one that got mad about Regina not citing Zelena or not even thinking about her in the decision of abandoning Storybrooke? I hate how the writers ignore her.

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    • LadyTremaine wrote:
      Am i the only one that got mad about Regina not citing Zelena or not even thinking about her in the decision of abandoning Storybrooke? I hate how the writers ignore her.

      Or maybe something else is going on? I mean, Regina's happiness never really relied on Zelena anyway. Zelena relied on Regina more, so maybe she found true love or is just happy with Robin.

      There's literally no reason to say the writers ignored her. Maybe they'll even cover it when she appears -- she gets mad at Regina for not even thinking about her. How do you know?

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    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      LadyTremaine wrote:
      Am i the only one that got mad about Regina not citing Zelena or not even thinking about her in the decision of abandoning Storybrooke? I hate how the writers ignore her.
      Or maybe something else is going on? I mean, Regina's happiness never really relied on Zelena anyway. Zelena relied on Regina more, so maybe she found true love or is just happy with Robin.

      There's literally no reason to say the writers ignored her. Maybe they'll even cover it when she appears -- she gets mad at Regina for not even thinking about her. How do you know?

      I meant in the part she cited how everyone in Storybrooke was doing.

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    • I had mixed feeling about this episode. I love that Weaver is a good cop - I love that Rumpelstiltskin is a complex guy, but its nice to see him actually go good.

      Honestly, after the episodes promo, I kind of knew the direction the characters were going, so it wasn't a  big surprise for me. I would've preferred if they had split Hook, the way they did Regina, because the Serum Queen and Regina, are both equally parts of each other. I hope I can warm up to this new version of Hook.

      I enjoyed Emma's scenes (but why has no one in Storybrooke aged? Have they actally said anything about time moving differently in the NEF?) I understand that many fans wanted Emma to have a happy ending (and after her arc, she deseves it), but I wish they could've left it out until the season finale or something (obviously Hook has to be a part of her happy ending, so I get why they did what they did, and they are uncertain if JMo will return).

      Overall, I enjoyed it mostly. Continue to love Tremaine and Cinders. Glad to see Carlyle playing  a good character.

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    • Eskaver
      Eskaver removed this reply because:
      Spoilers
      01:45, October 15, 2017
      This reply has been removed
    • The Great Sorcerer wrote:

      Wait, these questions bugged me so much during the episode. 

      1. Is the Old Hook we see in 7x02 the Wish Realm Hook from 6x11?

      2. If the Old Hook (7x02) is the Wish Realm Hook from 6x11, how did he get to The New Enchanted Forest?

      (P.S. I know I asked these on a different forum blog, but I really need these answered XD)

      Answer.... the same way Serum!Evil Queen and Wish!Robin Hood made it to the original Enchnted Forest.

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    • I'm a little sad no one's acknowledged my (admittedly incredibly late) realization about Henry farther up above. lol

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    • (MOD): No spoilers means no spoilers. If it wasn't onscreen or related to the episode, it gets removed.

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    • LadyTremaine wrote:
      DatNuttyKid wrote:
      LadyTremaine wrote:
      Am i the only one that got mad about Regina not citing Zelena or not even thinking about her in the decision of abandoning Storybrooke? I hate how the writers ignore her.
      Or maybe something else is going on? I mean, Regina's happiness never really relied on Zelena anyway. Zelena relied on Regina more, so maybe she found true love or is just happy with Robin.

      There's literally no reason to say the writers ignored her. Maybe they'll even cover it when she appears -- she gets mad at Regina for not even thinking about her. How do you know?

      I meant in the part she cited how everyone in Storybrooke was doing.

      I don't know that we saw the entirety of that scene, did we? It seemed like we picked up in the middle. We don't know who all she talked about.

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    • Soooo Rogers is Wish Realm Killian. Who still exists.

      Meaning everyone from the Wish Realm is in fact real.

      Meaning Wish Realm Snow and Charming were real. And Regina killed them.

      Awesome.

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    • tbh all that matters to me is Emma's happiness and she was so freaking happy so yay! The Swan Believer fireside chat was beautiful and a huge slap in the face to people who seriously think Emma no longer loves Henry.

      Though seriously, 3 scenes in her last episode?

      Also I love how WR!Killian's redemption arc started out basically the same as actual Killian's redemption arc.

      Essentially "god dammit I have to do the right thing here don't I?"

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    • I actually don't know how to react to this episode. I love Colin, he is a great actor and did an amazing job but... Why couldn't just let him go along with Jennifer? What is the point if Rogers isn't the Hook we've known for years? I don't get it.

      Though, I admit that I am interested in Rogers' daughter's storyline, and I bet it's Rapunzel. I have a question though, did Wish Hook arrive in the New EF thanks to the bottle? And if so how did he know Tremaine?

      Emma was... Okay I guess? It was obvious that she was pregnant and her goodbye to Henry was touching.

      Present day story was less engaging than flashback, but Rogers and Weaver's dynamic was interesting. I like also Sabine and her friendship with Jacinda (BTW, Dania's acting improved) and Roni is always the best (loved Regina's scenes with Henry in flashback as well).

      My grade is 7/7.5

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Aine1989 wrote:
      Though seriously, 3 scenes in her last episode?


      Weren't there 5 or 6?

      On the Jolly with Killian and Henry

      Telling Henry she's pregnant

      Discussing the pregnancy with Henry

      Saving Wish Hook's life

      Saying Wish Hook should team up with Henry

      Saying goodbye

      I don't quite remember, but I think there was an HH scene between when they were discusing that Wish Hook and Regina would stay behind and when Emma and Killian left so there would be 6 scenes. But if not, then there were 5 scenes. In any case, there were more than 3 scenes.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • AlbOuat wrote:
      I actually don't know how to react to this episode. I love Colin, he is a great actor and did an amazing job but... 

      It is obvious that Colin loves playing that crazy, fat old man. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • AlbOuat wrote:
      I actually don't know how to react to this episode. I love Colin, he is a great actor and did an amazing job but... Why couldn't just let him go along with Jennifer? What is the point if Rogers isn't the Hook we've known for years? I don't get it.

      And why exactly would it have made more sense to create another entirely new character?

      Wish Hook is no different from Cindy, Tremaine, Drizzle, Alice, Tiana, etc. -- he's a brand new main character for the requel. But by going with Wish Hook instead of Captain Jack Sparrow from the New Enchanted Forest played by Zelda Williams, they got to keep a talented, fan-favorite actor who loves the show instead of having to cast a brand new one and get the audience to love them and the new character.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      AlbOuat wrote:
      I actually don't know how to react to this episode. I love Colin, he is a great actor and did an amazing job but... Why couldn't just let him go along with Jennifer? What is the point if Rogers isn't the Hook we've known for years? I don't get it.
      And why exactly would it have made more sense to create another entirely new character?

      Wish Hook is no different from Cindy, Tremaine, Drizzle, Alice, Tiana, etc. -- he's a brand new main character for the requel. But by going with Wish Hook instead of Captain Jack Sparrow from the New Enchanted Forest played by Zelda Williams, they got to keep a talented, fan-favorite actor who loves the show instead of having to cast a brand new one and get the audience to love them and the new character.

      I didn't say anything about a new character. I just don't understand why they created this complicated storyline when they could have just wrote off both Emma and Hook together. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • DatNuttyKid wrote:

      Wish Hook is no different from Cindy, Tremaine, Drizzle, Alice, Tiana, etc. -- he's a brand new main character for the requel. 

      Not exactly.... since, Wish!Hook's story only diverged from Hook-Prime's, when the Evil Queen did not/cast her original curse. OUaT does not have to show his origin story, because the audience already knows it. The flashbacks we will be seeing will be the teamup with Henry, and further back of Hook and his daughter. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • AlbOuat wrote:

      I didn't say anything about a new character. I just don't understand why they created this complicated storyline when they could have just wrote off both Emma and Hook together. 

      Colin O'Donoghue was still on contract, and ABC probably would not have renewed OUaT without him.

      As for the storyline.... it is obvious the missing girl would have been Emma and Hook's daughter, had Jennifer Morrison not left the show. All the writers did was give this storyline to an alternate version of Hook, who already existed, and made him a single father. I may not be the biggest fan of the twist, but it is far from complicated. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Esk's Grade Report

      Plot (2 out of 3)

      + They reused an aspect of their universe--Wish Relam, partially.

      + The NEF events were cool, despite there was no explanation for LAdy Tremaine holding such power. I can see if she mentioned that the prince gave her the authority. Writers, you can't evil queen a villain if they aren't a queen!

      o Macguffin was used, did have technicalities, but it was a little "vial of magic". The form-changing magic was akin to the one in OUATIW.

      o Present Day...had similar problems with the worldbuilding aspect of authority. You can't Regina (S1) Tremaine because she's an urban developer CEO and those kids' parents aren't paying $550 to see their kids. But the subplots are piling up and give each character something to do and intermingle in different ways.

      Character (2.5 out of 4)

      + Old: Weaver is a little confusing, but that can give way to intrigue. Rogers is actually an alternate Hook that can be developed but dangerously falls into "Hook redux", however this might be due to the continuing flahbacks, but he should continue being disitict from Hook. You can tell the difference between Serum Queen and EQ (flashback), so I'd hope we can keep a good chunk of difference. The curse must be thin-layered as everyone's personalities are pretty similar to their normal selves. Emma's resolution was perfectly acceptable. 

      - New: Henry is a mixed bag, but still is on the positive side, but there frankly seems that he cannot grow whatsoever. Finding his story was pretty much seasons 4 to 6, but it could work with higher stakes (such as voilating Authorial rules). Jacinda is pretty much on par with last episode, but she's a bit too hostile towards Henry in a detrimental way. It seems almost one-sided and bordering superfluous. As a major buildingblock for both characters and this season, Henry seems infatuated and Jacinda shows little interest from time to time. The Belfreys seem a little one-note.

      + Tiana, whose name has not been said yet for no reason, seemed enjoyable as well as the new characters (paritially in the NEF)

      Balance (1.5 out of 2)

      - Jane and Jerome usually do a toned-down version of Adam and Eddy, which is a nice ideal; however, I think it was a little out of balance this episode as the humor was there, but the grit and realism seemed stretched thin.

      Fandom Outlook (0.5 out of 1)

      - Everything's going to be a mixed response for a while until a blowout episode. I nitpick, but there's a time to recognize whether you watch to nitpick or to enjoy yourself. Some are valid, others....stretch things, whether ignorantly or just for spite.

      Overall (6.5 out of 10)

      - Pretty much, everything about this episode, bar a few aspects, is mediocre, which is unfortunate. The writing just wasn't up to it, I guess. Though personally, I'd probably rank it higher.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Eskaver wrote:

      Esk's Grade Report

      Overall (6.5 out of 10)

      - Pretty much, everything about this episode, bar a few aspects, is mediocre, which is unfortunate. The writing just wasn't up to it, I guess. Though personally, I'd probably rank it higher.

      Generally agree with this statement, but would personally rate the episode 7/10. Only, because I enjoyed it more than the premiere.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      Eskaver wrote:

      Esk's Grade Report

      Overall (6.5 out of 10)

      - Pretty much, everything about this episode, bar a few aspects, is mediocre, which is unfortunate. The writing just wasn't up to it, I guess. Though personally, I'd probably rank it higher.

      Generally agree with this statement, but would personally rate the episode 7/10. Only, because I enjoyed it more than the premiere.

      I try to be a bit more objective because it's pretty common to love poorly written episodes in any show/movie and the opposite. Mediocre writing is mediocre, even if I think the episode was pretty entertaining.

      Like a Disney fan might have loved Street Rats, but that was pretty poor writing. Then, there's Heartless, where it's pretty good writing, but less recognized.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Eskaver wrote: I try to be a bit more objective because it's pretty common to love poorly written episodes in any show/movie and the opposite. Mediocre writing is mediocre, even if I think the episode was pretty entertaining.

      Like a Disney fan might have loved Street Rats, but that was pretty poor writing. Then, there's Heartless, where it's pretty good writing, but less recognized.

      Heartless was probably the strongest episode of S6. Personally, I felt 7.02 was slightly better written than 7.01. Not to mention, the acting was more consistent.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • I think just given that this one had more characters and dynamics that people loved from the original show (Swan Believer, Captain Swan, Emma) makes it more likeable.

      Unless you;re one of those raging "hurr burr everything with Hook is awful" folks in which case..... sucks to be you

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Aine1989 wrote:
      I think just given that this one had more characters and dynamics that people loved from the original show (Swan Believer, Captain Swan, Emma) makes it more likeable.

      Unless you;re one of those raging "hurr burr everything with Hook is awful" folks in which case..... sucks to be you

      True, they did have more dynamics, but I feel they should have altered it a bit to strengthen them. Like Hook was essentially written off too, but he didn't get a big farewell.

      The Henry and Hook dynamic should have been strengthened, especially with Hoook-W on the scene now.

      My grade for characters sort of dipped due to the new characters. After all, we have the old create the foundation for the new to thrive...and they could do better with that.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Eskaver wrote:

      My grade for characters sort of dipped due to the new characters. After all, we have the old create the foundation for the new to thrive...and they could do better with that.

      We know the writers can do better, which is what makes this disheartening. If the new characters do not improve soon, S7 will be a complete disaster. Wish!Hook has the advantage of still being portrayed by Colin O'Donoghue, but the rest of the new characters do not. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:

      the acting was more consistent.

      Agree

      Acting in 7x01 was subpar. Especially Cinderella and Tremaine

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Have to give a shout out to Colin's acting in this episode. He pulled of Wish!Hook's mannerisms and trying desperately to be convincing as real Killian perfectly.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Aine1989 wrote:
      Soooo Rogers is Wish Realm Killian. Who still exists.

      Meaning everyone from the Wish Realm is in fact real.

      Meaning Wish Realm Snow and Charming were real. And Regina killed them.

      Awesome.

      Depends. Maybe the Wish Realm works the same way video games do. In a video game if you kill a character it doesn't matter, because they are not real. However, what if, by some kind of magic, the characters from that video game find a way to step into our world? Once they step into our world they then become real. Perhaps that's the way the Wish Realm works. Maybe, the characters that are from the Wish Realm, are not real as long as they are in the Wish Realm. But the moment they step into another realm they become real.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ArcaneDust17 wrote:
      Aine1989 wrote:
      Soooo Rogers is Wish Realm Killian. Who still exists.

      Meaning everyone from the Wish Realm is in fact real.

      Meaning Wish Realm Snow and Charming were real. And Regina killed them.

      Awesome.

      Depends. Maybe the Wish Realm works the same way video games do. In a video game if you kill a character it doesn't matter, because they are not real. However, what if, by some kind of magic, the characters from that video game find a way to step into our world? Once they step into our world they then become real. Perhaps that's the way the Wish Realm works. Maybe, the characters that are from the Wish Realm, are not real as long as they are in the Wish Realm. But the moment they step into another realm they become real.

      I like your example, I must say :D But I think the reason they call them "not real" is because they were created by a wsh. They are actually alive and kicking xD It's really about the definiton of your "real". If you ask me, they are not. I can't call some people who were created by magic as real. Hook is also not real to me so.. :P

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • CadoDoan wrote:
      ArcaneDust17 wrote:
      Aine1989 wrote:
      Soooo Rogers is Wish Realm Killian. Who still exists.

      Meaning everyone from the Wish Realm is in fact real.

      Meaning Wish Realm Snow and Charming were real. And Regina killed them.

      Awesome.

      Depends. Maybe the Wish Realm works the same way video games do. In a video game if you kill a character it doesn't matter, because they are not real. However, what if, by some kind of magic, the characters from that video game find a way to step into our world? Once they step into our world they then become real. Perhaps that's the way the Wish Realm works. Maybe, the characters that are from the Wish Realm, are not real as long as they are in the Wish Realm. But the moment they step into another realm they become real.
      I like your example, I must say :D But I think the reason they call them "not real" is because they were created by a wsh. They are actually alive and kicking xD It's really about the definiton of your "real". If you ask me, they are not. I can't call some people who were created by magic as real. Hook is also not real to me so.. :P

      Except now we know that they weren't even created by the wish. Hook wouldn't have a history with Lady Tremaine or a daughter (who's old enough to play chess) if they didn't.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      CadoDoan wrote:
      ArcaneDust17 wrote:
      Aine1989 wrote:
      Soooo Rogers is Wish Realm Killian. Who still exists.

      Meaning everyone from the Wish Realm is in fact real.

      Meaning Wish Realm Snow and Charming were real. And Regina killed them.

      Awesome.

      Depends. Maybe the Wish Realm works the same way video games do. In a video game if you kill a character it doesn't matter, because they are not real. However, what if, by some kind of magic, the characters from that video game find a way to step into our world? Once they step into our world they then become real. Perhaps that's the way the Wish Realm works. Maybe, the characters that are from the Wish Realm, are not real as long as they are in the Wish Realm. But the moment they step into another realm they become real.
      I like your example, I must say :D But I think the reason they call them "not real" is because they were created by a wsh. They are actually alive and kicking xD It's really about the definiton of your "real". If you ask me, they are not. I can't call some people who were created by magic as real. Hook is also not real to me so.. :P
      Except now we know that they weren't even created by the wish. Hook wouldn't have a history with Lady Tremaine or a daughter (who's old enough to play chess) if they didn't.

      I thought those events happened after the episode "Tougher Than the Rest". Like we know, the time of NEF runs faster than ours. But I don't know how Hook did not age that much.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • CadoDoan wrote:
      DatNuttyKid wrote: Except now we know that they weren't even created by the wish. Hook wouldn't have a history with Lady Tremaine or a daughter (who's old enough to play chess) if they didn't.
      I thought those events happened after the episode "Tougher Than the Rest". Like we know, the time of NEF runs faster than ours. But I don't know how Hook did not age that much.

      I think, it is a combination of the two. When Aladdin created that realm, he created its history as well. While they were born from a wish, they still had actual backstories. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      CadoDoan wrote:
      DatNuttyKid wrote: Except now we know that they weren't even created by the wish. Hook wouldn't have a history with Lady Tremaine or a daughter (who's old enough to play chess) if they didn't.
      I thought those events happened after the episode "Tougher Than the Rest". Like we know, the time of NEF runs faster than ours. But I don't know how Hook did not age that much.
      I think, it is a combination of the two. When Aladdin created that realm, he created its history as well. While they were born from a wish, they still had actual backstories. 

      Hmm, so you're saying he also altered other people's mind so that Lady Tremaine and Hook know each other. But in reality, they don't. God how powerful is this genie magic! xD

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • CadoDoan wrote:

      Hmm, so you're saying he also altered other people's mind so that Lady Tremaine and Hook know each other. But in reality, they don't. God how powerful is this genie magic! xD

      Phenomenal cosmic powers!!!! 

      Think about it..... Wish!Hook only left his realm to search for Emma. Meaning, he already had a missing daughter in S6. Besides, how do we not know that Lady Tremaine comes from the Wish Realm?

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      CadoDoan wrote:

      Hmm, so you're saying he also altered other people's mind so that Lady Tremaine and Hook know each other. But in reality, they don't. God how powerful is this genie magic! xD

      Phenomenal cosmic powers!!!! 

      Think about it..... Wish!Hook only left his realm to search for Emma. Meaning, he already had a missing daughter in S6. Besides, how do we not know that Lady Tremaine comes from the Wish Realm?

      I doubt she is, but I suppose it's possible.

      Didn't Wish!Hook actually say that the realm has always existed? I think that makes more sense than Aladdin's wish also creating two people in a different realm, including one who was the stepmother to Cinderella.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • My thoughts are a tad bit simpler. Wish Realm = Parallel Realm that the wish just moved/gave access to.

      It's like if you had access to a parallel realm where Once failed in their pilot. Once you realize that, you sort of think everything around is "fake", despite it is very real for that parallel universe.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Eskaver wrote:
      My thoughts are a tad bit simpler. Wish Realm = Parallel Realm that the wish just moved/gave access to.

      It's like if you had access to a parallel realm where Once failed in their pilot. Once you realize that, you sort of think everything around is "fake", despite it is very real for that parallel universe.

      This is what I was trying to say.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • For this to make sense, W!Hook has to meet Tremaine AFTER we saw him in 6x11 and before 7x02

      The Wish World was created in 6x10. So, there can't be any connection with other realms prior to that. (except if Lady Tremaine also comes from the W! Realm)

      They better keep that in mind or there will huge plot holes here

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Maybe the Wish Realm always existed. Like a paralel universe you know. It's about alternate choices. Maybe all Aladdin did was to send Emma to that world which is one of the other infinitve alternate worlds. But there's also A&E's comments about it being the wish created it. So, it's confusing. :P

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • CadoDoan wrote:
      Maybe the Wish Realm always existed. Like a paralel universe you know. It's about alternate choices. Maybe all Aladdin did was to send Emma to that world which is one of the other infinitve alternate worlds. But there's also A&E's comments about it being the wish created it. So, it's confusing. :P

      Yeah, the first part. 

      Genie magic isn't that powerful as to create an entire new realm at a whim. I think the wish simply poofed Emma and Regina, later, to a parallel realm.

      So, you can travel within a universe, between universe, and in and between pocket universes.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Eskaver wrote:
      CadoDoan wrote:
      Maybe the Wish Realm always existed. Like a paralel universe you know. It's about alternate choices. Maybe all Aladdin did was to send Emma to that world which is one of the other infinitve alternate worlds. But there's also A&E's comments about it being the wish created it. So, it's confusing. :P
      Yeah, the first part. 

      Genie magic isn't that powerful as to create an entire new realm at a whim. I think the wish simply poofed Emma and Regina, later, to a parallel realm.

      So, you can travel within a universe, between universe, and in and between pocket universes.

      Kudos to magic beans! xD

      So A&E was wrong about the part where they said the wish created it?

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • The only thing that makes me wonder whether or not this was a real, constantly existing parallel realm is that there wasn't an Emma. Unless Emma actually replaced the other Emma.

      This should probably be its own thread, though...

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Eskaver wrote:
      CadoDoan wrote:
      Maybe the Wish Realm always existed. Like a paralel universe you know. It's about alternate choices. Maybe all Aladdin did was to send Emma to that world which is one of the other infinitve alternate worlds. But there's also A&E's comments about it being the wish created it. So, it's confusing. :P
      Yeah, the first part. 

      Genie magic isn't that powerful as to create an entire new realm at a whim. I think the wish simply poofed Emma and Regina, later, to a parallel realm.

      So, you can travel within a universe, between universe, and in and between pocket universes.

      Then why W!Robin didn't age like the rest of the people?

      In 6x11 it was said that he didn't age because the world was created out of a wish and is not real

      Also, like DatNuttyKid says, there should be an Emma in that world, if it is a parallel world. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      The only thing that makes me wonder whether or not this was a real, constantly existing parallel realm is that there wasn't an Emma. Unless Emma actually replaced the other Emma.

      This should probably be its own thread, though...

      Sure.

      Though I was using that to say......Wish Realm could just be a World in NEF's universe. So, Hook-W just went around and apparently had a kid, etc. Like there's an old, twisted version of FTL and the new version, which can explain ties to old stories, yet new variation and those that spread across our world and cultures.

      So, Isaac wrote about Snow and Regina, while Henry would have wrote about his flawed version of Snow White, using the Wish versions, etc.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      The only thing that makes me wonder whether or not this was a real, constantly existing parallel realm is that there wasn't an Emma. Unless Emma actually replaced the other Emma.

      This should probably be its own thread, though...

      I'm inclined to believe A&E about the wish creating the Wish Realm.

      Therefore, the world was created around the real Emma, so there was never a Wish Realm Emma to begin with. There technically was one, because Real Emma has those memories, but she embodied the same space and body as the Real Emma, so she may as well have never existed.

      And as for Robin not aging, he may very well have been old and gray when Emma's wish created the Realm. Or he may not have been there at all. But it's extremely obvious that he was rejuvenated/created when Charming wished for the Queen to get everything she deserved, since she ended up with Robin at the end of her arc.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ArcaneDust17 wrote:
      Aine1989 wrote:
      Soooo Rogers is Wish Realm Killian. Who still exists.

      Meaning everyone from the Wish Realm is in fact real.

      Meaning Wish Realm Snow and Charming were real. And Regina killed them.

      Awesome.

      Depends. Maybe the Wish Realm works the same way video games do. In a video game if you kill a character it doesn't matter, because they are not real. However, what if, by some kind of magic, the characters from that video game find a way to step into our world? Once they step into our world they then become real. Perhaps that's the way the Wish Realm works. Maybe, the characters that are from the Wish Realm, are not real as long as they are in the Wish Realm. But the moment they step into another realm they become real.

      WR! Robin was real enough for Regina not to kill him. And the WR was real enough for Robin and the EQ to go back to and they had to leave because the people of the WR  wanted them dead for the murder of their King and Queen.

      So yeah. The WR was real and Regina murdered two people and left an innocent child an orphan.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      DatNuttyKid wrote:
      The only thing that makes me wonder whether or not this was a real, constantly existing parallel realm is that there wasn't an Emma. Unless Emma actually replaced the other Emma.

      This should probably be its own thread, though...

      I'm inclined to believe A&E about the wish creating the Wish Realm.

      Therefore, the world was created around the real Emma, so there was never a Wish Realm Emma to begin with. There technically was one, because Real Emma has those memories, but she embodied the same space and body as the Real Emma, so she may as well have never existed.

      And as for Robin not aging, he may very well have been old and gray when Emma's wish created the Realm. Or he may not have been there at all. But it's extremely obvious that he was rejuvenated/created when Charming wished for the Queen to get everything she deserved, since she ended up with Robin at the end of her arc.

      I am more inclined towards the thoery that  Robin is young and foxy (if you'll excuse the pun) because it was Regina's/EQ's wish. Which is why Killian was a bumbling boozer, because she is always making  fun of his alcoholism. Its why Emma was a weakling because Regina thinks she is weak and has to be forced to be strong. And its why Robin was young and hot , because thats what she wanted him to be.

      If we want to move this should we move it back to the 6x10 discussion?

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Something interesting I just heard in a podcast: If Hook and Wish!Hook were summoned by the same bottle, why weren't Regina, Wish!Regina (who we've yet to meet) and Serum!Regina all brought to the New Enchanted Forest as well?

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      Something interesting I just heard in a podcast: If Hook and Wish!Hook were summoned by the same bottle, why weren't Regina, Wish!Regina (who we've yet to meet) and Serum!Regina all brought to the New Enchanted Forest as well?

      Because Wish!Regina and Serum!Regina go by Evil Queen maybe?

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      Something interesting I just heard in a podcast: If Hook and Wish!Hook were summoned by the same bottle, why weren't Regina, Wish!Regina (who we've yet to meet) and Serum!Regina all brought to the New Enchanted Forest as well?

      How I see it was that a bottle went to each location: Hook and Regina and Emma (in SB), Wish Hook in NEF, etc. 

      Under technicality, Wish Evil Queen and Serum Evil Queen have Evil Queen as their monikers. So, separate though totally not. Even if Queenie got the bottle in the EF, she might not have a bean to toss, or perhaps she contacted Regina and co offscreen, etc. Wish Realm Evil Queen might just be dead, seeing how Snow and David were ancient.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      Something interesting I just heard in a podcast: If Hook and Wish!Hook were summoned by the same bottle, why weren't Regina, Wish!Regina (who we've yet to meet) and Serum!Regina all brought to the New Enchanted Forest as well?

      The bottle, and its magic, belonged to Hook. Which, is probably why it only summoned his doppleganger. 

      Also, Serum!Regina is essentially the Wish Realm's Evil Queen.  

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      Something interesting I just heard in a podcast: If Hook and Wish!Hook were summoned by the same bottle, why weren't Regina, Wish!Regina (who we've yet to meet) and Serum!Regina all brought to the New Enchanted Forest as well?
      The bottle, and its magic, belonged to Hook. Which, is probably why it only summoned his doppleganger. 

      Also, Serum!Regina is essentially the Wish Realm's Evil Queen.  

      Wish!Regina was mentioned to be old and banished, while Serum!Regina was from the original Enchanted Forest, being the dark side of the original Regina.

      But yeah, it's probably the bottle thing LBR

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:

      Also, Serum!Regina is essentially the Wish Realm's Evil Queen.  

      No

      The W!Evil Queen was created in that land with the wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      And, as Edward said, the W!Evil Queen was said to be old and banished by the fairies. Since she is onld, we can assume she is powerless now, since you can de-age yourself with magic

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • 8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.

      She does exit. But she didn't appear on screen. That's it.

      She is somewhere in the Whish Realm. 

      Maybe they didn't show her because it would have been way too confusing to have 3 Evil Queens on the show. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • 8Rob wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      She does exit. But she didn't appear on screen. That's it.

      She is somewhere in the Whish Realm. 

      Maybe they didn't show her because it would have been way too confusing to have 3 Evil Queens on the show. 

      Plus, Lana probably didn't want to have to play a defeated old woman version of herself.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.

      The information about Wish!Hook's daughter heavily implies that the Wish Realm always existed and the Serum Queen's wish merely provided access to it rather than creating it. There are some other continuity issues resulting from this -- specifically, Robin -- but it's what we have to go by right now.

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    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      The information about Wish!Hook's daughter heavily implies that the Wish Realm always existed and the Serum Queen's wish merely provided access to it rather than creating it. There are some other continuity issues resulting from this -- specifically, Robin -- but it's what we have to go by right now.

      Henry was 13 at the end of Season 6, and is presumably in his early 20's in these flashbacks (since he left home after high school, or at 17-18, and he had to age enough to go from Gilmore to West), meaning a decade could've passed during which Wish!Hook had a daughter.

      And the flashbacks themselves are at least 10 years before the present day since Lucy obviously hasn't been born yet and she's 10 in the present day. So Wish!Hook's daughter could be up to 20 years old at this point.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • CoolDudeAl wrote:
      8Rob wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      She does exit. But she didn't appear on screen. That's it.

      She is somewhere in the Whish Realm. 

      Maybe they didn't show her because it would have been way too confusing to have 3 Evil Queens on the show. 

      Plus, Lana probably didn't want to have to play a defeated old woman version of herself.

      She was the one who begged to play the Peddler version of Regina in Hat Trick, so I doubt that. It's far more likely that Wish!Regina had no significance to the plot, so she was never featured, but still exists. Just like Wish!Baelfire existed but died, and no information about him was given whatsoever.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      DatNuttyKid wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      The information about Wish!Hook's daughter heavily implies that the Wish Realm always existed and the Serum Queen's wish merely provided access to it rather than creating it. There are some other continuity issues resulting from this -- specifically, Robin -- but it's what we have to go by right now.
      Henry was 13 at the end of Season 6, and is presumably in his early 20's in these flashbacks (since he left home after high school, or at 17-18, and he had to age enough to go from Gilmore to West), meaning a decade could've passed during which Wish!Hook had a daughter.

      And the flashbacks themselves are at least 10 years before the present day since Lucy obviously hasn't been born yet and she's 10 in the present day. So Wish!Hook's daughter could be up to 20 years old at this point.

      Hook had his daughter before he met Emma. He was cursed by the Witch to not be able to love, then when he met Emma he thought she might be able to break the curse.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      The information about Wish!Hook's daughter heavily implies that the Wish Realm always existed and the Serum Queen's wish merely provided access to it rather than creating it. There are some other continuity issues resulting from this -- specifically, Robin -- but it's what we have to go by right now.

      It was created by the wish. That was made clear

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • 8Rob wrote:
      DatNuttyKid wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      The information about Wish!Hook's daughter heavily implies that the Wish Realm always existed and the Serum Queen's wish merely provided access to it rather than creating it. There are some other continuity issues resulting from this -- specifically, Robin -- but it's what we have to go by right now.
      It was created by the wish. That was made clear

      It was made clear originally, but that has been brought into unclarity now. You can't just shrug off facts because they disagree with past indications.

      The Wish Realm was only said to be created by the wish by Adam and Eddy -- who we know change their mind constantly -- and in-continuity by characters who don't necessarily understand it (Regina, Emma, Charming, etc.) Wish!Hook, who has lived there his entire life, said it always existed, and the timeline now lines up with that.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Edward Zachary Sunrose wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      8Rob wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      She does exit. But she didn't appear on screen. That's it.

      She is somewhere in the Whish Realm. 

      Maybe they didn't show her because it would have been way too confusing to have 3 Evil Queens on the show. 

      Plus, Lana probably didn't want to have to play a defeated old woman version of herself.
      She was the one who begged to play the Peddler version of Regina in Hat Trick, so I doubt that. It's far more likely that Wish!Regina had no significance to the plot, so she was never featured, but still exists. Just like Wish!Baelfire existed but died, and no information about him was given whatsoever.

      That was hardly a defeated old woman, that was Regina in a hag disguise for one scene. And she was still very much in control.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • DatNuttyKid wrote:
      8Rob wrote:
      DatNuttyKid wrote:
      ChocolatEyes613 wrote:
      8Rob wrote:

      The W!Evil Queen created in that land with wish while the SerumQueen was in SB.

      There was no Evil Queen in the Wish Realm, only the pre-programed memories of her.
      The information about Wish!Hook's daughter heavily implies that the Wish Realm always existed and the Serum Queen's wish merely provided access to it rather than creating it. There are some other continuity issues resulting from this -- specifically, Robin -- but it's what we have to go by right now.
      It was created by the wish. That was made clear
      It was made clear originally, but that has been brought into unclarity now. You can't just shrug off facts because they disagree with past indications.

      The Wish Realm was only said to be created by the wish by Adam and Eddy -- who we know change their mind constantly -- and in-continuity by characters who don't necessarily understand it (Regina, Emma, Charming, etc.) Wish!Hook, who has lived there his entire life, said it always existed, and the timeline now lines up with that.

      Also, Eddy said it was not real and Adam said it was (or the other way around lol). Even the writers cannot agree on whether or not it was real

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    • I didn't read the above, but can someone explaine me how Emma, Regina and Hook are still young and Henry is a grown up?Does time move differently in the New Enchanted Forest?

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    • ByHerm . wrote:
      I didn't read the above, but can someone explaine me how Emma, Regina and Hook are still young and Henry is a grown up?Does time move differently in the New Enchanted Forest?

      Basically, yes ^^

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    • Well tbf, in the 7x02 flasbacks Henry was what, 20? Which was only 6-8 years after 6x22.....

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    • Yes but i know that Regina in season 6 was almost 46 and i believe that after 6-8 years she would look mutch older.

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    • Also i know her age because i saw the timeline.

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    • ByHerm . wrote:
      Yes but i know that Regina in season 6 was almost 46 and i believe that after 6-8 years she would look mutch older.

      This is not the case. Regina is only about eight or so years older than Snow(who's the same age as Emma).

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    • ByHerm . wrote:
      Yes but i know that Regina in season 6 was almost 46 and i believe that after 6-8 years she would look mutch older.

      Cora looked the same from like 30 to 60, so Regina can also look the same.

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    • CoolDudeAl wrote:
      ByHerm . wrote:
      Yes but i know that Regina in season 6 was almost 46 and i believe that after 6-8 years she would look mutch older.
      Cora looked the same from like 30 to 60, so Regina can also look the same.

      Regina is nearly 70 now, though, so it's a stretch.

      • When Snow is 10, Regina is 18.
      • 18 years later, when the curse is cast, Regina is 36 (according to Emma in 3x01 she and her parents are "the same age"; according to the timeline in 3x11, it's less than a year between 1x01 and 3x011, so Emma is STILL 28 and Regina still 36.)
      • Then there's the "missing year"; Regina turns 37.
      • According to Fiona - and, assuming she's right - then Henry is 14 in 6x22, meaning approx 3 years have passed and Regina should be 40.
      • Then there's a gap of approximately 2 years between "The Final Battle" and Henry leaving in "Hyperion Heights", between 2015 and Henry leaving in late 2017 as he's approx 16 years and 10 months old, meaning Regina is about 42 when Henry departs.
      • According to an interview with Lana, it's been "seven years" (for Regina, who is "older, even though she doesn't look it") at the time of the "rescue" of Henry, making her 49.
      • There's an undisclosed time gap here of more than a decade (as Henry has to get with Cinderella, get her pregnant, add the nine months pregnancy, birth and Lucy being 10 when Henry vanishes and presumably before the curse is cast) meaning Regina is, at minimum, 59 years old when the curse is cast, possibly closer to 69 if about two decades pass in the New Enchanted Forest (it took Snow and Charming about 5 years approx to defeat Regina in the original EF, so not too much of a stretch for another couple of years, adding the 10 when Lucy is growing up).
      • Add in another 6 months (nothing in Hyperion Heights says that Lucy and the others have not been aging. No-one says anything about it), meaning Regina is approximately, biologically, 70 at this point.
        Preparing Editor Spell
    • That’s a lot of speculation.

      Regina could very well leave NEF before Lucy is conceived. Also, Lana’s seven years could mean that Henry has aged seven years.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • She was referring to Regina in the interview as she says Regina is "older, but doesn't look it". And Regina cannot have left as she was affected by the curse. So she was STILL THERE as of Lucy being 10. So, by fitting it all with canon, Regina is nearing 70. 

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      She was referring to Regina in the interview as she says Regina is "older, but doesn't look it". And Regina cannot have left as she was affected by the curse. So she was STILL THERE as of Lucy being 10. So, by fitting it all with canon, Regina is nearing 70. 

      Still speculation. Regina could have been turned to stone, Lucy aged up, etc. So, we cannot assume anything until shown.

      After all, Lady Tremaine is surely in her 40s, yet hasn't aged either.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • Gabrielle Anwar is 47, so assuming they're the same...


      And, as I've shown by canon, NOT speculation.

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    • HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      Gabrielle Anwar is 47, so assuming they're the same...


      And, as I've shown by canon, NOT speculation.

      It's speculation to say that Regina has aged up beyond her 40s, to have been in NEF when Lucy was born, etc.

      Nevertheless, that's less on the topic of this episode as there's nothing that says much that she has aged. We don't even know Lucy's age, lol. (Adam and Eddy both said 9 and 10 in interviews.)

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      ByHerm . wrote:
      Yes but i know that Regina in season 6 was almost 46 and i believe that after 6-8 years she would look mutch older.
      Cora looked the same from like 30 to 60, so Regina can also look the same.
      Regina is nearly 70 now, though, so it's a stretch.
      • When Snow is 10, Regina is 18.
      • 18 years later, when the curse is cast, Regina is 36 (according to Emma in 3x01 she and her parents are "the same age"; according to the timeline in 3x11, it's less than a year between 1x01 and 3x011, so Emma is STILL 28 and Regina still 36.)
      • Then there's the "missing year"; Regina turns 37.
      • According to Fiona - and, assuming she's right - then Henry is 14 in 6x22, meaning approx 3 years have passed and Regina should be 40.
      • Then there's a gap of approximately 2 years between "The Final Battle" and Henry leaving in "Hyperion Heights", between 2015 and Henry leaving in late 2017 as he's approx 16 years and 10 months old, meaning Regina is about 42 when Henry departs.
      • According to an interview with Lana, it's been "seven years" (for Regina, who is "older, even though she doesn't look it") at the time of the "rescue" of Henry, making her 49.
      • There's an undisclosed time gap here of more than a decade (as Henry has to get with Cinderella, get her pregnant, add the nine months pregnancy, birth and Lucy being 10 when Henry vanishes and presumably before the curse is cast) meaning Regina is, at minimum, 59 years old when the curse is cast, possibly closer to 69 if about two decades pass in the New Enchanted Forest (it took Snow and Charming about 5 years approx to defeat Regina in the original EF, so not too much of a stretch for another couple of years, adding the 10 when Lucy is growing up).
      • Add in another 6 months (nothing in Hyperion Heights says that Lucy and the others have not been aging. No-one says anything about it), meaning Regina is approximately, biologically, 70 at this point.

      We don't know Regina actually stays in NEF the whole time, so I'd say she's about 50. I'm certain even if she did stay it did not take 20 years for Henry to have a 10 year old, so even then, she'd only be 60 max.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      She was referring to Regina in the interview as she says Regina is "older, but doesn't look it". And Regina cannot have left as she was affected by the curse. So she was STILL THERE as of Lucy being 10. So, by fitting it all with canon, Regina is nearing 70. 

      Yes she can. All it means is she was in NEF at the time of the curse. She could have left when Lucy was born and came back right before the curse was cast. It's not like it's hard to find a magic bean anymore.

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • CoolDudeAl wrote:
      HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      She was referring to Regina in the interview as she says Regina is "older, but doesn't look it". And Regina cannot have left as she was affected by the curse. So she was STILL THERE as of Lucy being 10. So, by fitting it all with canon, Regina is nearing 70. 
      Yes she can. All it means is she was in NEF at the time of the curse. She could have left when Lucy was born and came back right before the curse was cast. It's not like it's hard to find a magic bean anymore.

      True, but WHY would she leave? She stayed with Henry to "find her happy ending", and assuming there's a couple of years for them fighting Tremaine, plus the nine months for Cinderella to be pregnanct (that's a min 3 years already!) plus the ten years of Lucy growing up (and if being with her son and granddaughter IS Regina's happy ending, again, WHY would she leave that when that is what she is searching for?) then there is 14/15 years, putting Regina in her mid sixties, no matter what as she is 49 when she rescues Henry, so add on another (approx) 15 ish years puts her at 64 anyway...

        Preparing Editor Spell
    • HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      She was referring to Regina in the interview as she says Regina is "older, but doesn't look it". And Regina cannot have left as she was affected by the curse. So she was STILL THERE as of Lucy being 10. So, by fitting it all with canon, Regina is nearing 70. 
      Yes she can. All it means is she was in NEF at the time of the curse. She could have left when Lucy was born and came back right before the curse was cast. It's not like it's hard to find a magic bean anymore.
      True, but WHY would she leave? She stayed with Henry to "find her happy ending", and assuming there's a couple of years for them fighting Tremaine, plus the nine months for Cinderella to be pregnanct (that's a min 3 years already!) plus the ten years of Lucy growing up (and if being with her son and granddaughter IS Regina's happy ending, again, WHY would she leave that when that is what she is searching for?) then there is 14/15 years, putting Regina in her mid sixties, no matter what as she is 49 when she rescues Henry, so add on another (approx) 15 ish years puts her at 64 anyway...

      None of this is about this episode, so I'd gonna cease the discussion here.

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    • HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      CoolDudeAl wrote:
      HarryPotterRules1 wrote:
      She was referring to Regina in the interview as she says Regina is "older, but doesn't look it". And Regina cannot have left as she was affected by the curse. So she was STILL THERE as of Lucy being 10. So, by fitting it all with canon, Regina is nearing 70. 
      Yes she can. All it means is she was in NEF at the time of the curse. She could have left when Lucy was born and came back right before the curse was cast. It's not like it's hard to find a magic bean anymore.
      True, but WHY would she leave? She stayed with Henry to "find her happy ending", and assuming there's a couple of years for them fighting Tremaine, plus the nine months for Cinderella to be pregnanct (that's a min 3 years already!) plus the ten years of Lucy growing up (and if being with her son and granddaughter IS Regina's happy ending, again, WHY would she leave that when that is what she is searching for?) then there is 14/15 years, putting Regina in her mid sixties, no matter what as she is 49 when she rescues Henry, so add on another (approx) 15 ish years puts her at 64 anyway...

      We don't know why, we'll have to watch and see what happens. Like Esk said though, this is off topic for the thread, so we shouldn't keep discussing it here.

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    • A Spy in the Mirror
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